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*x*                                                                     *x*
*x*            Copyright (C) 1995 University of Pennsylvania            *x*
*x*                                                                     *x*
*x*    The data in this file are part of a preliminary version of the   *x*
*x*    Penn Treebank Corpus and should not be redistributed.  Any       *x*
*x*    research using this corpus or based on it should acknowledge     *x*
*x*    that fact, as well as the preliminary nature of the corpus.      *x*
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FILENAME:	2232_1083_1039
TOPIC#:		328
DATE:		910324
TRANSCRIBER:	CRR
UTT_CODER:      aabo
DIFFICULTY:	2
TOPICALITY:	3
NATURALNESS:	1
ECHO_FROM_B:	1
ECHO_FROM_A:	1
STATIC_ON_A:	0
STATIC_ON_B:	1
BACKGROUND_A:	2
BACKGROUND_B:	2
REMARKS:        Speaker A dominated conversation, and seems to often
change topic to religion.  (This transcription is garbage.  This conversation
should be thrown out or redone -dsj)

===========================================================================
  

o          A.1 utt1:  <Noise> Okay.  /
qw          A.1 utt2: {D So } what are your opinions on it? /  

^h          B.2 utt1:  {D Well, } let me preface it.  /
%          B.2 utt2: I'm a, - /
sd          B.2 utt3: I was a staff officer in Vietnam, in sixty-nine and seventy -- /  
 
b          A.3 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

sd          B.4 utt1:  -- {C and } I'm in active reserve now,  /
sd          B.4 utt2: {C so, } {F uh, } I'm probably not going to have the ((   ))  you think I would have. /  

b          A.5 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

%          B.6 utt1:  {F Uh, } it's, - /
sd*         B.6 utt2: I was an interesting, in that I think that he gave the American people [ some, + ] {F uh, } {F uh, } a sense of the fact [ that, + that, ] {F uh, } wars are really run by politicians. /  *[[I -> It??]]

b          A.7 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

%          B.8 utt1:  {F Uh, } I, - /
qy          B.8 utt2: are you old enough to remember the war? /  

nn          A.9 utt1:  N-, - /
sd^e          A.9 utt2: not much.  /
sd          A.9 utt3:  I'm twenty-eight,  /
nn          A.9 utt4: {C so. }  No.  /
sd          A.9 utt5:  I really don't remember anything about it.  /
sd          A.9 utt6:  I guess I was about ten when it ended.  /
^g         A.9 utt7: Right? /  

ny          B.10 utt1:  Yeah. /  

sd          A.11 utt1:  I was born in sixty-two,  /
qw          A.11 utt2: {C so } when did it end? /  

sd          B.12 utt1:  {D Well, } December seventy-two, was when we bombed North Vietnam,  and then they released the prisoners in early seventy-three,   

b          A.13 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          B.14 utt1:  [ in that, + in that ] time frame. /  

sd          A.15 utt1:  {C Because, } I was ten,  /
sd          A.15 utt2: {C and } I don't remember a lot about anything at that time in my life very much in,   

qy         B.16 utt1:  I think,   

+          A.17 utt1:  great detail. /  

+          B.18 utt1:  [ the, + the ] significant thing [ is, + is ] today [ [ did, + did you, ] + {F uh, } did you ] see Barbara Walters interview with Schwartzkopf? /  

nn          A.19 utt1:  No.  /
sd^e          A.19 utt2:  I didn't, /  

x          B.20 utt1:   ((   )) .   

sd          A.21 utt1:  {C but } [ I, + I ] did read the book.  /
%          A.21 utt2:  I ha-, - /
%          A.21 utt3: do ha-, - /
sd          A.21 utt4: I have six years of college,  /
sd          A.21 utt5: {C so } I did read, and study about the Vietnam war though.  /
sd          A.21 utt6:  {C So } I am pretty fa-, - /
%          A.21 utt7:  {D you know, } I'm more, -/  

qw          B.22 utt1:  {D Well, } [ wha-, + what's ] --   

sd          A.23 utt1:  familiar with it than, -/  

+          B.24 utt1:  -- your perspective on it? /  

^q          A.25 utt1:  Mine.  /
sv          A.25 utt2: [  I think, + {F uh, } I think ] that there was a lot of rebellion in our nation, and that, I think it was the right thing to do, to try and not to take away, to, {D you know, } (( just leave their freedoms there ))  <noise> and to,  {D you know, } get rid of some of the atrocities that were going to./
h          A.25 utt3: [  I don't, + I don't ] know, I don't really,  /
sd*         A.25 utt4: I'm tired of pacifist though,  / *[[pacifist -> pacifists?]]
sd          A.25 utt5: {D see } on the other hand, I'm a pac-, - /
sd          A.25 utt6: I'm really struggling with it.  /
o@            A.25 utt7:  Am I a pacifist, physical pacifist, I'm a Christian,  /
sv          A.25 utt8: {C and } I believe that the real warfare is not with Saddam Hussein, or the North Vietnamese,  /
sv          A.25 utt9: {C but } it's in spiritual kingdoms, and that the real warfare is done, {D you know, } in your prayer closet, on your knees.  /
sd          A.25 utt10:  {C So, } in a way, in a sense I'm a pacifist,  /
o@            A.25 utt11: {C but } I'm really not.  You know what I'm saying? /  

ny          B.26 utt1:  Yes. /  

sd          A.27 utt1:  I don't think just lay back and not do anything.  /
sv(^q)          A.27 utt2: I think, lets go to war,  /  *[[lets -> let's]]
^q              A.27 utt3: {C but } let's go to war praying,  /
^q              A.27 utt4: {C and } let's go to war for that way  /
%          A.27 utt5: {C so, } -/  

sd          B.28 utt1:  {D Well, } {D well, } the difficulty I have, is that, {F uh, } are we our neighbor's keepers. /  

b          A.29 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

sv*         B.30 utt1:  {C And, } this is what I find particularly difficult in that, {F uh, } if we see injustice, and weather it's in [ a, + ] {F uh, } {D you know, } Chicago, [ [ or, + {F uh, }   *[[typo weather -> whether]]

b          A.31 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+          B.32 utt1:  or, ] + or ] Dallas, [ I, + I ] think if we see it, {D you know, } we see John Wiley Price hollering injustice, I think that's wrong.  /
qy^t         B.32 utt2:  {D Now } the question [ is, + is ] was there injustice in Vietnam,  /
qrr^t          B.32 utt3: {C or } was,   
 
b          A.33 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+*         B.34 utt1:  there injust in Iraq Kuwait, /   *[[typo injustice?]]

b          A.35 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

qh           B.36 utt1:  <Noise> the difficult, [ I, + ] point [ is, + is ] to, where do we step in,  /
o@          B.36 utt2: [ {C and, } + {F uh, }   

b          A.37 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+@          B.38 utt1:  {C and, ] } I think [ [ that we, + that's, ] + that's ] the part I have difficulty,  /
sv(^q)*         B.38 utt2: {C and } the, the other part is, [ that  [ the, + the, ] + ] [ [ [ when, + when your, ] + when your, ] + when your ] looking at Vietnam, and you say, {D well, } is fifty-eight thousand lives worth it.  / *[[3 typos your -> you're]]
o@          B.38 utt3: {C And, }   

b          A.39 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+@          B.40 utt1:  I don't know that anything is worth fifty-eight thousand lives. /  

sv          A.41 utt1:  Still have a problem with, {F uh, } - /
sd          A.41 utt2: {D you know, } I haven't come to an absolute conclusion on my opinion on this,  /
sd          A.41 utt3: [ {C but, } + {C and } ] I know other Christians would disagree with me.  /
sd          A.41 utt4:  My husband and I, are kind of not even in agreement on this,  /
sd          A.41 utt5: {C but } we don't fight over it or anything,  /
qh          A.41 utt6: {C but, } {D you know, } how can, - /
sd(^q)          A.41 utt7: {D you know, } the Bible says bless your enemies and bless those that curse you,  /
sd(^q)          A.41 utt8: {C and } it's like, be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, kind,  /
qh              A.41 utt9: {C so } it's like  how can you, - /
h          A.41 utt10: I don't know, for me, - /
sd           A.41 utt11: I don't know, {D you know, } I can't say that I agree with Vietnam, because how can you be gentle unto all men, [ and, + and ] then shoot them. /  

o@           B.42 utt1:  {D Well, } the,   

%          A.43 utt1:  {D So, } /  

+@          B.44 utt1:  other issue [ [ is, + is, ] + is ] [ how do you allow, + {F uh, } [ how, + how ] do you allow ] injustice.  Just like [ the, + the ] policeman [ in, +  in ] Los Angeles --   

b          A.45 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+@          B.46 utt1:  -- [ how could, + how could, ] - /
qh          B.46 utt2: could you stand there and watch them beat that guy. /
qy          B.46 utt3:  If your brother or your sister were being beaten,   

b          A.47 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+          B.48 utt1:  by the authorities do we step in?  /
na          B.48 utt2: {D Well. }  In some cases we would,  /
sv          B.48 utt3: {C and } [ I, + I ] think that's what makes it so difficult. /  

b          A.49 utt1:  Yeah.  /
aa          A.49 utt2:  It is a difficult thing.  /
sd(^q)          A.49 utt3: {C But then, } vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord,/
^q         A.49 utt4: {C and } I will pay.  /
sv          A.49 utt5: {C So, } I think God is ultimately in charge of what goes on,  /
sd*         A.49 utt6: {C and } I know, like now  ((   ))  in China he did all these terrible things,  / *[[probably Mao]]
sd          A.49 utt7: {C and } they were [ te-, +  terrible, ]  /
sd          A.49 utt8: {C and } he was going to be accountable for them,/
sd          A.49 utt9: [ {C and, } +  {C but } ] if you look back, and you say wait a minute, while he was in power, he built roads, he put in all the temples, [ he, +  he ] unified the Chinese language. /
sd          A.49 utt10: It was impossible for missionaries to [ do, + ] accomplish  anything in China --   

x          B.50 utt1:   ((   )) .   

+          A.51 utt1:  -- because of all that,  /
sv          A.51 utt2: {C and so } even in North and South Vietnam, I bet you'd see the same thing, and that now he builds roads  /
%          A.51 utt3: {C so, then } it - /
sd          A.51 utt4: ((   ))  {C and then } he dropped dead, twenty-five years premature, he dropped dead,  /
sv          A.51 utt5: {C and so } something good did come out of that, in that now, you see what I mean, if like now, -/  

b          B.52 utt1:  Yeah.  /
qh           B.52 utt2:  [ {C But, } + {C but } ] [ the other, + the other ] difficulty [ is, + is ] that it's just, [ if, + if ] you take the (( )) [ to, + to ] feed my sheep --   

b          A.53 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  
 
+          B.54 utt1:  -- and the question is, who are my sheep,  /
qh           B.54 utt2: {C and } the idea, do we go out and  feed these people when they're hungry. /  
 
^q         A.55 utt1:  {D Well. }  Bless your enemies, if your enemy is hungry, feed him,  /
^q          A.55 utt2:    [ if he, + if he ] [ needs your, + ] asks for your shirt, give him your coat also.  /
sd          A.55 utt3:  {C So, } if [ [ [ the, +   

x          B.56 utt1:   ((   )) .   

+          A.57 utt1:  the, ] + the, ] + the ] South Vietnamese, they asked us to help them. - /
^g          A.57 utt2: Right?  /
qy          A.57 utt3: Is that right? /  

ny          B.58 utt1:  Yes.  /
sd^e          B.58 utt2: {F Uh, } they did,  /
sv*         B.58 utt3: {C but, } I think the biggest difficulty [ is, + is ] that when your at an  ((   ))  economy like South Vietnam, {D well, } [ the, + ] then reality, {F uh, } [ the, + the ] [ poor farmer, + the poor rice farmer, ] was going to pay taxes -- /  *[[your -> you're]]

b          A.59 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

qh           B.60 utt1:  -- {C and } the question is, who was he going to pay it to? /  

b          A.61 utt1:  Yeah. /  

sv          B.62 utt1:  {F Uh, } the communists are [ the, + ] all alleged democrats.  {F Uh, } /  

b          A.63 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

sd          B.64 utt1:  democratic formed government,  /
sv          B.64 utt2: {C and } [ [ [ I, + I  think that's, ] + I think, ] + I think, ]  {F uh, } that's a little, [ was a + ] difficult part, there,  /
%          B.64 utt3: [ {C and, } + {C and, } ] I, - /
sd          B.64 utt4: we didn't understand the culture.  /
%          B.64 utt5:  We couldn't, {F uh, } - /
sd          B.64 utt6: [ we had, + {F uh, } we had ] [ a, + a ] young lady that was fourteen that worked [ on our, + ] in the unit I was commander of, that appeared to be eight or nine years old, /
sd          B.64 utt7: [ {C and, } + {C and } ] the people looked like children -- /  

b          A.65 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

sd          B.66 utt1:  -- {E I mean, } you couldn't imagine that one [ [ would, + would, ] + would ] conceal a bomb [ and + --   

b          A.67 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          B.68 utt1:  -- and ] do these kind of things.  /
sv          B.68 utt2:  I think socially, it really destroyed a lot of the people [ that, + that ] went over and saw these people.  /
sd          B.68 utt3:  You just couldn't believe [ that they would, + that they would ] be mean, [ [ [ and, + and, ] + and, ] + and ] drop bombs and kill people,  /
sd          B.68 utt4: {C and then } --   

b          A.69 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  
 
+*         B.70 utt1:  -- we would turn around [ and, + and ] (( nay palm ))  them, {D you know, }  / *[[typo napalm]]
%          B.70 utt2: if -- -/  

b          A.71 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

sv          B.72 utt1:  -- {C and } I think there was [ a lot of, + a lot of ] tearing of emotions,  /
sv          B.72 utt2: {C and } I think that if anything, that, when (( ))  he was saying the idea that we learned, [ we l-, + we ] learned a lot from Vietnam -- /  

b          A.73 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

sd          B.74 utt1:  -- {D now, } [ it was, + it was ] in general, bad, /
sd          B.74 utt2: [ {C but, } + {C and, } ] I don't know, the problem is now, - /
sd          B.74 utt3: [ I'm, + I'm ] concerned a little bit,   

x          A.75 utt1:  <Throat_clearing>.   

+          B.76 utt1:  that now that the gulf war is on, that we're going, - /
sv          B.76 utt2: I think it was a good war,  /
sv          B.76 utt3: {C and } it was okay --   

b          A.77 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          B.78 utt1:  -- to go beat up on people,  /
sv          B.78 utt2: {C and } [ I think that, + I think ] we need [ to, + ] a little more justice at home.  /
sd          B.78 utt3: I'm not sure how we get that,  /
qy^d          B.78 utt4: <laughter> wonder if there's a connection there, /
%          B.78 utt5: {C but }  ((   )) , -/  

b          A.79 utt1:  Yeah.  /
b          A.79 utt2:  {C But then } again, yeah,  /
sv          A.79 utt3: I'd say it is wrong to  ((   )) - /
sd          A.79 utt4: {C and } I'm not saying president Bush made the wrong decision.  /
sd          A.79 utt5:  I think I'm lacking in my, - /
sd          A.79 utt6: I don't think I can come to a complete conclusion on how I feel about the Vietnam war, because I'm going to interpret that, through the Bible,  /
sd          A.79 utt7: {C and } I've kind of always, - /
sd          A.79 utt8: I've been a Christian five years,  /
sd          A.79 utt9: {C and } I've kind of avoided [ [ that, + that, ] + those, ] the war things,  and how God approaches that because I think it's just now coming up to where I really feel like I [ need to, + [ come, + ] {D you know, } need to ] decide, 

sv          B.80 utt1:  {D Well, } the difficulty [ is -- +   
  
+          A.81 utt1:  what I feel. /  

+@          B.82 utt1:  -- is ] if you look in the old test meat, and in the numbers of places that, {F uh, } the Lord went out and just simply struck down,  / *[[old test meat = Old Testament]]
sv*          B.82 utt2: {C and } that was part of the problem, when they went into the promise land,   *[[ should be promised land]]

b          A.83 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          B.84 utt1: [ [ that they, + that they, ] + {F uh, } they ] didn't destroy everybody, /  

b          A.85 utt1:  Right.  /
sd         A.85 utt2:  They --   

x          B.86 utt1:   ((   )) .   

+          A.87 utt1:  -- left a woman, and (( a child, and [ a, + ] ))   

o@          B.88 utt1:  [ {C And, } +   

+          A.89 utt1:   ((   ))  the sheep.  /
o          A.89 utt2:  Yeah. /  

+@          B.90 utt1:  {C and } ] [ that, +  that, ] - /
qy          B.90 utt2: {D you know, } {C and } you, - /
sv          B.90 utt3: I think that's one of those things when we get to heaven we're going to ask God <laughter>. /  

ba          A.91 utt1:  I know. /  

qh            B.92 utt1:  Why did you do it that way <laughter>. /  

sd          A.93 utt1:  {C But then } again, though  (( Jesus ))  the grace pushes you beyond the law, you know what I'm saying,  /
sd(^q)            A.93 utt2: {D like, } {C so } he didn't just say, [ don't kill your, + don't kill your ] enemies,  /
^q              A.93 utt3: {C but, } not only don't kill them, bless them.  /
o@                A.93 utt4:  {D You know, } {C and so, }  therefore when we have an enemy come against us, [ I really feel like,  [ that, + ] + I really feel like, I know I do feel this strongly, that when, if we had someone come and attack us, the best way to handle it would be to bless them, and  humbly go to their other king, or the other ruler, and say, what have we done to offend you.  /
qh            A.93 utt5: What can we do to rectify this situation,  /
sv            A.93 utt6: {C and } that God would move in that sovereignly, /  

x          B.94 utt1:   ((   )) .   

sv          A.95 utt1:  {C and } he would get the glory, though, no king, no, - /
sv          A.95 utt2: Bush wouldn't, because it wouldn't make any sense, you know what are I'm saying? /  

b          B.96 utt1:  Yeah. /  

sd          A.97 utt1:  It would look absolutely, ridiculously stupid,  /
sv*         A.97 utt2: {C but } it would work out, because, if you follow the scriptural principals, it's going to work out, because [ those are, + ] that's the best way to do it, {D you know, }  / *[[spelling = principle]]
sv          A.97 utt3: {C but } the thing [ is, + is ] that then God gets the glory, not a president, not a king,  /
sv          A.97 utt4: {C and } I think that's a problem for a lot of politicians, is they want the glory. /  

%          B.98 utt1:  {D Well, } {C and, } [ I, + I, ] - /
qy          B.98 utt2: {C and } [ even if the, + even ] at the local level, when somebody's assaulted --   

b          A.99 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+          B.100 utt1:  -- what do you do, turn the other cheek? /  
 
%          A.101 utt1:  N-, - /
^h          A.101 utt2: {D well, } I believe, personally, - /
%          A.101 utt3: I ho-, - /
sd         A.101 utt4: [ I + <laughter> I ]  ((   ))  woman always says, my husband always goes three that, I guess. - /
%          A.101 utt5: Yeah,  /
sd          A.101 utt6: [ if the one, + if somebody ] broke in my house, I would pray that I would have this faith, [ ta-, to, + ] to take authority over that,  /
sd          A.101 utt7: {C and } I know people that have done that. - /
sd          A.101 utt8: {E I mean, } I know that there have been people who have had people break in their homes, and just say I bind you in Jesus name,  /
%          A.101 utt9: your, - /
%          A.101 utt10: n-, - /
%          A.101 utt11: I just, - /
sv         A.101 utt12: {C and } rebuke any enemy, because I believe it's a spiritual war that's going on,  /
sd          A.101 utt13: {C and } it's not normal for someone to come into someone elses home,  /
sd^r          A.101 utt14:  ((   ))  that's not normal,  /
sd          A.101 utt15: there's something going on there, and that I would have discernment by the holy spirit to deal with pride over that. /
qy          A.101 utt16: Do you see what I mean? /  

ny         B.102 utt1:  Yeah. /  

sv*         A.103 utt1:  {C And then } the same in Vietnam, [ you would, + you wouldn't ] handle Vietnam the same way, you would handle, {F uh, } Saddam Houssein.  / *[[Hussein]]
sd          A.103 utt2:  {C But, } [ I was, + I have ] a problem with all the killing,  /
sd          A.103 utt3: {C but } I'm not a new ager, I don't believe  /
sd          A.103 utt4: ((   ))  I am not for one world government.  /
sd         A.103 utt5:  I'm not for all these new age things.  /
sd          A.103 utt6: [ [  I, + I, ] + {D you know, } I ] don't have a problem with, {F uh, } national identity,  /
sd          A.103 utt7: {C and, } I'm an American,  /
sd          A.103 utt8: {C and } having different nations, and all of this. - /
sd          A.103 utt9: {C But, } I'm concerned about the killing that went on there, because I just feel like God has a better way to handle it, than that,  /
%          A.103 utt10: {C and } ... -/ 
