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*x*                                                                     *x*
*x*            Copyright (C) 1995 University of Pennsylvania            *x*
*x*                                                                     *x*
*x*    The data in this file are part of a preliminary version of the   *x*
*x*    Penn Treebank Corpus and should not be redistributed.  Any       *x*
*x*    research using this corpus or based on it should acknowledge     *x*
*x*    that fact, as well as the preliminary nature of the corpus.      *x*
*x*                                                                     *x*
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FILENAME:	2962_1257_1174
TOPIC#:		341
DATE:		910524
TRANSCRIBER:	JKP
UTT_CODER:	TC
DIFFICULTY:	1
TOPICALITY:	1
NATURALNESS:	1
ECHO_FROM_B:	1
ECHO_FROM_A:	1
STATIC_ON_A:	1
STATIC_ON_B:	1
BACKGROUND_A:	1
BACKGROUND_B:	1
REMARKS:        Speaker A dominates conversation. 

==========================================================================
  

sv          A.1 utt1:  {D Well, } {F uh, } it seems to me  [ that, + {F uh, } that ] - /
sd          A.1 utt2: I do not know whether the jury system, {F uh, } - /
sd          A.1 utt3: [ I, +  I ] should not say I  do not know.  /
sv          A.1 utt4:  I do not feel very, {F uh, } stronger that the jury system should be changed.  /
sv          A.1 utt5:   It seems to have worked, {F uh, } time immemorial.  /
sv          A.1 utt6: {C And } when, {F uh, } difficult  decisions, {F uh, } are made, {F uh, } {F uh, } {F uh, } they generally prove out to be right by things that occur later on. /  

b          B.2 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

sd          A.3 utt1:  {F Uh, } I know in some cases now in  some states, depending on the criminal code, {F uh, } a unanimous verdict is not required.  /
sd          A.3 utt2:   {C And } indeed some juries are no longer twelve people,  /
sd          A.3 utt3: they are down to [ as  little, +  as small ] as six people [ [ [ in, +  I think, in ] petty, ] +  [ [ [ in, + in, ] + {F uh, } in, ]   {F uh, } in ] minor ] felonies, [ and, +  {F uh, } and ] misdemeanor trials. /  

b^r          B.4 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

sv          A.5 utt1:  {F Uh, } I think that the judges should  be left to do most of the sentencing, simply because, {F uh, } [ there is always, + {F uh, } [ there is, +    

x          B.6 utt1:  <Cough>.   

+          A.7 utt1:  there is ] always ] a jury that  might be <laughter> swayed, {F uh, } by the moment, {F uh, } [ to +  either to ]  be too lenient or too vengeful, I guess. /  

b          B.8 utt1:  Yeah.  /
sv          B.8 utt2:  On the other hand, {F uh, }  [ attorney, + {F uh, } {F uh, } justices ] are more apt to, {F uh, } understand, {D you know, } [ the cr-, +  the prison ]  crowding problems and things like that,   

b^r          A.9 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          B.10 utt1:  and have that sway their decisions one way or the other.   

qy          A.11 utt1:  {C But, } {E I mean, } [ is not that, +    

+          B.12 utt1:  {D You know. } /  

+          A.13 utt1:  {F uh, } is that ] a reflection then  of what is really happening in the real world?  /
sv          A.13 utt2: [ [ If, + if, ] + if ] they keep giving  everybody hundred year sentences, and the people in various states, it does not seem that  people want to be taxed to build more prisons.  Or even [ in, + ] for that matter,  {F uh, } repair [ the, + {F uh, } the ] lack of judges [ [ and, + and, ] + and ] other, {F uh, } -/  

aa          B.14 utt1:  Yeah.  /
sv          B.14 utt2:  I think that is what is happening.  /
sv          B.14 utt3:   I think, {F uh, } the judges are trying to save the people from having to,   

x          A.15 utt1:  <Laughter>.   

+          B.16 utt1:  the cost of new prisons. /  

aa          A.17 utt1:  Yeah, /  

%          B.18 utt1:  They, -/  

aa^r          A.19 utt1:  yeah,  /
aa          A.19 utt2: {D you know, } that might be it.  /
%          A.19 utt3:  {E I mean, } [ they, +    

sv(^q)          B.20 utt1:  they are saying,    

+          A.21 utt1:  they ] certainly, -/  

+          B.22 utt1:  {F oh, } {D well, } {D you know, }   

sd          A.23 utt1:  [ I do not, +    

+          B.24 utt1:  [ the, + the ] people cannot --   

+          A.25 utt1:  I don't ] know how --   

+          B.26 utt1:  -- afford it. /  

+          A.27 utt1:  -- it is in Virginia,  /
sd          A.27 utt2:  {C but } in Florida now, {F uh, } {F uh, } {F uh, }  [ at eighteen years, +  someone was just sentenced to eighteen years, ]   {A I heard it on TODAY, } {F uh, } without any specific recommendation for, {F uh, } {F uh, }  {F uh, } {F uh, } {F uh, } {F uh, } waving the normal,  {F uh, } procedures.  /
sd          A.27 utt3: {C And } the eighteen years will,  {F uh, } translate into something like, {F uh, } four point seven, [ [ if every, +  if the, ] +   if the ] prisoner is a model prisoner, /  

b          B.28 utt1:  Yeah. /  

sd          A.29 utt1:  {C and } indeed the present overcrowding  conditions, {F uh, } prevail. /  

x          B.30 utt1:  <Sneezing>.   

sv          A.31 utt1:  {C Plus, } I guess, there was some credit  for time this guy had already spent in jail waiting for trial. /  

b          B.32 utt1:  Right. /  

aa          A.33 utt1:  {C So, } {F uh, } yeah,  /
sv          A.33 utt2: you might be right  about that.  /
h          A.33 utt3: [ [ I, +  I, ] +  I ] do not know,  /
sv          A.33 utt4: it just seems to me that [ [ only about, + {F uh, }  from what I read, only about ninety percent of the ca-, ] + only about ten percent of the  [ pa-, +  cases ] ] come for trial anyway. /  

b          B.34 utt1:  Right. /  

sd          A.35 utt1:  {C And, } {F uh, } only about, {F uh, }  [ f-, +  four ] or five percent of, {F uh, } - /
%          A.35 utt2: [ in  the, + in the ] very end - /
sv          A.35 utt3: {E or } [ [ less than, + less than   half the trials that go to, ] +  {F uh, } less than half the cases that go to ] trial, {F uh, } end up [ [ w-, +  with, ] +    

^2          B.36 utt1:  With a conviction? /  

+          A.37 utt1:  {F uh, } with ] the jury actually making the verdict. /  

b          B.38 utt1:  {F Oh, } okay. /  

sv          A.39 utt1:  That most of it is plea bargained,  {F uh, } half way through  /
sv          A.39 utt2: [ {C or, } + {C or } ] most of the cases are plea bargained anyway. /  

b          B.40 utt1:  Right. /  

qo          A.41 utt1:  {C But, } {F uh, } {F uh, } how do you  feel [ about the, + {F uh, } about the ] jury system itself?  /
qy          A.41 utt2: [ Do you, + do you ] think that should  be changed?  /
qrr          A.41 utt3: {C Or } [ do you, + do you ] know in Virginia [ whether it is, +  if they have ] smaller juries  /
%          A.41 utt4: {C or, } -/  

sd          B.42 utt1:  {F Uh, } I do not know exactly what  the size of the juries.  /
sd          B.42 utt2:  I know one of my friends was, {F uh, } {F uh, } brought up for jury duty. /  

b          A.43 utt1:  Yeah. /  

%          B.44 utt1:  For, - /
sd          B.44 utt2: {C and } he only heard very,  {D you know, } piddly type cases.  /
sd          B.44 utt3: Most of it was, {F uh, } robberies or things like that, {D you know, }  /
sd          B.44 utt4:  it was not any serious crimes.  /
sv          B.44 utt5: {C So } apparently even for the smallest crimes,  they give the person [ the, + {D you know, } any ] felony anyways. /  

b          A.45 utt1:  Yeah.  /
%          A.45 utt2:  {D Well, } I guess we, -/  

sd          B.46 utt1:  [ Th-, + they ] give the person the option for a jury. /  

b          A.47 utt1:  Yeah.  /
sd          A.47 utt2:  I guess we always focus on  criminal trials [ with th-, + with the ] jury.  /
sd          A.47 utt3: {C But } I know you have a right to ask for a jury [ in, +   

b          B.48 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+          A.49 utt1:  in ] any sort of a case that even  where damages [ [ [ are, +  are, ] +  are, ] + {F uh, } are ] the result of some sort of [ a, +  {F uh, } an ]  action that you are bringing against someone else. You can ask --   

b^r          B.50 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+          A.51 utt1:  -- for that to be heard before a jury.  /
sv          A.51 utt2:   Takes a heck of a long time, I guess, to get there --   

b^r          B.52 utt1:  Uh-huh. /  

+          A.53 utt1:  -- in some states.  /
h          A.53 utt2:  [ [ I, +  I, ] +  I ]  do not know, {F uh, }  /
sv          A.53 utt3: I should imagine Virginia, from what I read, {F uh, } {F uh, } is like  every other state.  /
sd          A.53 utt4: [ It, +  it ] is faced with, {F uh, } {F uh, } enormous costs to maintain  the jury system and the prison system and  the entire trial system.  /
sd          A.53 utt5:  {C Because } I guess,   

b          B.54 utt1:  Right. /  

+          A.55 utt1:  everywhere I read that there is a shortage of judges. /  

b^r          B.56 utt1:  Right. /  

sd          A.57 utt1:  Not that they won't appoint them  /
sv          A.57 utt2: {C but }  there is no budget for them, I guess.  /
sd          A.57 utt3:  [ Or, +   

b          B.58 utt1:  {F Huh. } /  

+          A.59 utt1:  and ] the courthouse that goes with  them and the bailiffs and the [ clerk, +  {F uh, }   

b          B.60 utt1:  Yeah.  /
^2          B.60 utt2:  Whatever. /  

+          A.61 utt1:  court clerks. ]  /
%          A.61 utt2: {C So } it seems, {F uh, } - /
o          A.61 utt3:  no,  /
sv          A.61 utt4: [ [ I, + I, ] + I ] do not think I would change it.  /
sd          A.61 utt5:  The more I verbalize it, [ I, +  I ]  do not think I would want to change the system. /  

b          B.62 utt1:  Right, /  

sd          A.63 utt1:  I do not --    

sd          B.64 utt1:  {F uh, } I do not think I would either. /  

+          A.65 utt1:  -- know what we would replace it with <laughter>. /  

aa          B.66 utt1:  Yeah.  /
aa          B.66 utt2:  I know,  /
sv          B.66 utt3: it, {F uh, } does seem  like [ [ [ the, + the, ] +  the, ] + the ] purpose of getting people in jail so that, {D you know, } [ the, +  the, ] - /
sd          B.66 utt4:   I cannot think of the word I am looking for.  /
sv          B.66 utt5: {D Anyway, } the deterrent.   

b          A.67 utt1:  Yes. /  

+          B.68 utt1:  For people [ [ to, +  to ] commit the cri-, +  {F uh, } to not to commit the crime ] is sort of gone away.  /
%          B.68 utt2: People have, - /
h          B.68 utt3: I do not know,  /
sv          B.68 utt4:  they just do not care any more.  /
sv          B.68 utt5: The benefit, I guess, of crime outweighs what the deterrent is. /  

sv          A.69 utt1:  {F Uh, } {C and } yet --   

%          B.70 utt1:  {D You know, } people that, -/  

+          A.71 utt1:  -- [ [ there are, + there are so many, ] +   there are so many ] people in prison.  /
sv          A.71 utt2: {E I mean } the prison population, {F uh, } as far as  [ I, +  I, ] {F uh, } {D you know, } - /
sd          A.71 utt3: my impression of it is [ that it has, +  that it has ]  doubled in the last ten years and tripled in the last twenty. /  

%          B.72 utt1:  {F Um. } /  

sd          A.73 utt1:  I mean it,  /
sd          A.73 utt2: [ so has our, +   I guess our population has ] grown some too.  /
sd          A.73 utt3:  {C But } [ there, +  there ] definitely is,  {F uh, } {F uh, } {D you know, } to me  [ the, +  one of the ] worst things that could ever happen, {F uh, }  from what I read and see and understand.  /
sd          A.73 utt4:  {E I mean } I do no think I could handle prison. /  

b          B.74 utt1:  Yeah. /  

sv          A.75 utt1:  {E I mean } it would be --   

sd          B.76 utt1:  {D Well, } I would be interested in --   

+          A.77 utt1:  -- very difficult, /  

+          B.78 utt1:  -- finding out what the, {F uh, }  percentage of drug related type things are, /  

sv          A.79 utt1:  {D Well, } there must be [ [ [ a,    

%          B.80 utt1:  {C and, } {F uh, } -/  

+          A.81 utt1:  ca-, + a, ] +  a, ] +  a ] very great degree of that. /  

b          B.82 utt1:  Yeah. /  

sd          A.83 utt1:  [ {C But, } + {C but } ] there again  [ I, +  I ] do not know if [ the, +  the ]  jury system itself, {F uh, } comes in to play there.  /
%          A.83 utt2: I would think that, - /
sv          A.83 utt3:   one of the things that  sort of bothers me is the ability, - /
sd          A.83 utt4: of course [ th-, +  it ]  is a constitutional right that the press must have here, is [ th-, +  the ]  interviewing of jurors after the trial.  /
sv          A.83 utt5: {E I mean } [ that, + it ] seems to me [ [ that, +  that, ] +  that ] when a jury makes a decision, they should not be asked, {F uh, } before television  cameras and newspaper reporters how they reached that decision.  /
%          A.83 utt6:  {E I mean, } I do not, -/  

b          B.84 utt1:  Yeah. /  

sv          A.85 utt1:  I imagine there is a [ certain, +  certain ]  right of the press to have the ability to ask that.  /
sv          A.85 utt2:  {C But } [ I, +  I ]  would think [ I, +  if I ] did anything, I would protect the juror [ from, +  from ]  any sort of an inquisition after <laughter>. /  

%          B.86 utt1:  {D Well, } I know, {F uh, }  /
sd          B.86 utt2:  on the other hand though, when, {F uh-, } after the Barry trial,   

b          A.87 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          B.88 utt1:  up here, {D you know, } the big local --   

b^r          A.89 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          B.90 utt1:  -- trial,   

b          A.91 utt1:  {F Oh, } yeah.  /
sd          A.91 utt2:  {D Well, }   

+          B.92 utt1:  as well as national. -/  

+          A.93 utt1:  I do a lot of business up in Washington.  /
sd          A.93 utt2:  I was there [ during the, +  during the ] trial actually,  /
%          A.93 utt3: yeah. /  

b          B.94 utt1:  Yeah.  /
sd          B.94 utt2:  {C And } the opposite was true of me.  /
sd(^q)          B.94 utt3:   {F Uh, } after the case was over, I was like, somebody get ahold of these people and  find out why in the world did they vote the way they did,   

b          A.95 utt1:  Yeah, /  

+          B.96 utt1:  {D you know } <laughter>. /  

b^r          A.97 utt1:  yeah,  /
b^r          A.97 utt2: yeah. /  

sd(^q)          B.98 utt1:  It was like, {D well, } a picture is not  good enough.  /
^q          B.98 utt2:  We want to see,  /
sd          B.98 utt3: I do not know what they wanted honestly <laughter>.  /
qy*          B.98 utt4:   Did they want the guy to, I do not know. - /*[[qy but its' abandoned]]
sv          B.98 utt5: {E I mean, } just because you feel  like he was being kicked on, which he certainly was, {D you know. }  /
%          B.98 utt6:  [ I think, + I, ] - /
sv          B.98 utt7:  no doubt in my mind the federal government picked him out and selected him to be --   

aa          A.99 utt1:  {F Oh, } I felt that way. /  

+          B.100 utt1:  -- prosecuted. /  

sd          A.101 utt1:  [ I felt, +    

sv          B.102 utt1:  {C But } --   

+          A.103 utt1:  I felt, ] -/  

+          B.104 utt1:  -- it does not matter.  /
sv          B.104 utt2: The guy was obviously --   

b          A.105 utt1:  no,  /
%          A.105 utt2: {C but, } -/  

+          B.106 utt1:  -- guilty <laughter>. /  

b          A.107 utt1:  Yeah <laughter>.  /
sd          A.107 utt2:  I always balanced  [ in the, +  in the ] situation.  /
sd          A.107 utt3: I remember the jurors, {F uh, }  /
sd(^q)          A.107 utt4: I thought to myself,  [ how did, +  how did ] - /
sd          A.107 utt5: [ they only, +  I think they only, ] {F uh, } found him --   

^2          B.108 utt1:  [ One, +  one ] count. /  

+          A.109 utt1:  -- guilty on one count.   [ Which was, {F uh, } not even, + which was a class something felony.  Which was not even ] punishable,   

b          B.110 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          A.111 utt1:  {F uh, } {F uh, } to the degree that they thought it.  /
h          A.111 utt2:  {C But } I do not know,  /
sv          A.111 utt3: maybe when you are there [ in the r-, +  in the courtroom ]  yourself and you are sitting there and you have got to make a judgment on somebody. - /
sv          A.111 utt4:  And the prosecutors do a lousy job,  /
sv          A.111 utt5: or maybe the evidence was not  as sensational as the media presented it.  /
sd          A.111 utt6:  {E I mean, } [ I, +    

b          B.112 utt1:  Yeah. /  

+          A.113 utt1:  I ] am not making excuses for <noise>.  /
sv          A.113 utt2:  That might be it. /  

b          B.114 utt1:  {D Well, } yeah.  /
sv          B.114 utt2:  I think we are getting, -/  

sd          A.115 utt1:  I think I am getting a call coming in. /  

b          B.116 utt1:  {F Oh } <laughter>. Okay. /  

fc          A.117 utt1:  All right, nice --   

fc          B.118 utt1:  {D Well, } it has been nice --   

+          A.119 utt1:  -- talking with you. /  

+          B.120 utt1:  -- talking --   

ft          A.121 utt1:  Thank you. /  

+          B.122 utt1:  -- to you.  /
fc          B.122 utt2: Uh-huh.  /
fc          B.122 utt3:  Bye-bye. / 
